912 uls vs Viking HF110

[chefwarthog]

I went to see vansairforce.com like ¨szicree¨ suggest and I fond a lot of blubbering but. I like facts and it seem that Eggenfellner as a lot of so so history with is Subaru engine convercision. And all your saying gus is to wait and see before to jump in, in franch we say: il faut laisser ****é le mouton! but one thread bring my attention the one of ¨Canadian Joy¨ and you will have to see by your self at:

http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...ad.php?t=67604

This thread is from vansairforce.com ¨It's a matter of history...

I have time on my side I have to bild my garage before to order my kit......

[Andrew G]

When I buy the (eventual) Kitfox... it will be Rotax powered, simply because convincing my insurance company to "go Experimental" will be tough enough with a very proven engine, which Rotax is... The only hate I have for the setup is the cost... it really is too damned much by a factor of 50%... don't worry, I am a capitalist and they do win the supply / demand debate every time...

With that said... I have to admit, I study all the engines that "compete" with the 912 (100 hp). Lycoming made a decent effort, but fell way short on the weight, it's still too heavy given the LSA rules... Continental, well, in my non-engineer opinion, they just fell short... The guy who put the Yamaha on his gyrocopter has some great things going, but he isn't a developer, so it's a one-off... not in my lifetime, and the Belgian engine seems like a good one but too small, and the Corvair, etc... back to the insurance company problem.

This Honda conversion and the argument the Egg guy puts forth makes some sense... You know that old flying saying? "if it looks like it can fly, it can, if it doesn't, it won't"... the Subaru didn't feel right with me, this Honda does. I have had a Honda outboard for many years... it runs like a sewing machine. The Fit engine has an excellent pedigree. The Rotax, actually evolved from a snowmobile right? And a 2 stroke one at that... the Fit, IMHO, has a superior pedigree... tinkering for 5 years will work the prop swing bugs out.

Egg is such a bad self promoter on the chat forums and in the videos it's funny, it's like watching a bad auto dealer, you know the guys with the toupes, etc... but, I have to thank him for his efforts to make affordable and safe flying for all... I do hope he becomes successful so he can make enough money to go in the lab where he probably excels... so he can get a professional marketing team...

So, Mr. Egg, keep doing what you are doing, I think there are enough early adopters out there who want to fly cheaply... just don't screw up.

[DesertFox4]

chefwarthog's info. copied from Van's site has been removed from his previous post.
Van's Airforce.com's site has specific rules for use of their site and all info. on it.
Breaking his #1 rule by copying and pasting directly from his site to this site without his written permission will not be allowed.



From Van's site:
Legal Terms and Conditions

Please review the following terms and conditions concerning your use of this site. By accessing, using or downloading materials from this web site (including the forums) you agree to follow and be bound by these terms and conditions.

1.

You may download, view, copy and print documents and graphics ("Documents") incorporated in this web site subject to the following: (1) the Documents may be used solely for personal, informational, non-commercial purposes; and (2) and will not be copied or posted on any networked computer or broadcast in any media; and (3) the Documents may not be modified or altered in any way. Except as expressly provided herein, you may not use, download, upload, copy, print, display, perform, reproduce, publish, license, post, transmit or distribute any information from this web site in whole or in part without the prior written permission of Doug Reeves.

[enyaw]

chefwarthog's info. copied from Van's site has been removed from his previous post.
Van's Airforce.com's site has specific rules for use of their site and all info. on it.
Breaking his #1 rule by copying and pasting directly from his site to this site without his written permission will not be allowed.

If chiefwarthog were to edit his post and put a link to the thread that he had previously quoted, would that be allowed?

Van's Airforce has a much broader readership and we have many common issues. I for one appreciate access to the cross-pollination and would hope that there was a way to share information w/out having to recreate others' searches based on cryptic references to another board.

[DesertFox4]

enyaw, I see no problem with a link to the site as long as it doesn't violate Doug's rules. I'll take a look tonight at the rest of his terms of use requirements but seems like that might be OK.

[szicree]

I went to see vansairforce.com like ¨szicree¨ suggest and I fond a lot of blubbering

I began my RV-4 back in '98 and due to life getting in the way took almost 10 years to finish. During that time I would frequent web forums such as this one to keep abreast of the latest developments. Eggenfellner's Subaru conversions came up quite frequently and much of the discussion was negative. The main issues I can recall were: cooling problems, poor performance, and gear drive failures. I believe the gear drive being used currently on the Sube is a 4th generation. Keep in mind that the first generation was marketed as fully tested. It is my understanding that the customers were expected to pay for the updated gearboxes. As I've said before, the question here is not whether the Honda motor is tough, but whether the engineering to adapt it to an aircraft is fully tested.

You had commented earlier that having some engine problems would be okay if you could save some money. I'm sure I don't need to point out that an engine failure on takeoff, over hostile terrain, water or at night can mean death. I know we don't like to talk about that, but deaths happen in this hobby.

Finally, have you considered the resale value of an alternate engined craft? Check around and I think you'll see that they can be tough to sell at anything but a big loss.

This is not meant to bash anyone who goes alternative, but those who have done it succesfully have done LOTS of homework.

[SkyPirate]

Amen on the "lot's of home work",..I actually bought a car ,.brand new off the show room floor with the style motor I'm using ,..it's got 65,000 miles on it so far and only an oil change every 2k miles has been done to it ( besides the 10th set of tires on the chassis),..still runs like day one,..now you have to understand ,..I use to race cars semi professionally at speeds over 100 mph ,..I am really testing this motors durability,..so it's not just a drive to the store and back ,.. it's 5500 to 6500 rpm coming into a R-100' corner at 90 miles an hour then subject it to 2.5 to 3G side load,..or end load in this case ,..(the motor is mounted in the car sideways) for 5 to 10 seconds at a time depending on the length of the corner,.. that would be like taking a 912 and flying it straight up wide open throttle for 5 to 10 seconds at a time repeatedly..

[Slyfox]

skypirate. I fly my 912 wide open for hours on end. I just make sure the rpm's are 5200. That's 120mph by the way.

[SkyPirate]

skypirate. I fly my 912 wide open for hours on end. I just make sure the rpm's are 5200. That's 120mph by the way.

ha ha show off now pull that stick back and go straight up and get all the oil on the back of the engine for 5 to 10 seconds ha ha

[Slyfox]

I do that all the time, usually peg the vsi at 2000. Now, what about that oil to the back of the engine??? How about me pushed back in the seat.