Newbie. Which model will fit me... if any

[bbutler455]

I have been restoring vintage sports cars and motorcycles since young. I notice that the cars from my youth that I considered roomy have shrunk. Retired and in my 60's I am thinking about building or restoring an experimental or LSA airplane. 99% of my flying will be solo, low and slow, fun flying. My problem is that I am a big boy - 6', 300lbs, and a size 4xl jacket. I need a light sport plane with folding wings that I will be comfortable in. This is for fun so I also don't want to deplete the portfolio doing it. Are any of the Kit Fox models or upgrades an option? Suggestions?

Thanks for your input,

bbutler455

[avidflyer]

A friend of mine was to big for the Avid Flyer A model he was building, so he ended up making it a single seater. His feet go on the outside pedals, and he made a joystick that had an S bend in it so it ended up more in the center of the plane. Worked just fine for him. The plane will probably be up for sale this spring, as he has some major health issues and probably wont make it till spring. Sad thing also, is he just put a new engine in the plane last fall, only has a couple of hours on it. I will be helping with the sale when the time comes. Another question that comes up when thinking about whether you will fit or not, is are you long legged or long torso? What is your inseam length? JImChuk

[tx_swordguy]

I fly an avid B model similar to the earlier kitfoxes. I do not think that even with bubble doors you would be able to make it a two person plane. Could you fit in it? Yes. I think any of the models either avid or kitfox would accommodate you but it is a small plane so be prepared for that. At six ft you might be cramped but I think you would be in anything that fits your desires. If you can get a kitfox 3-4 or a later avid it may make getting into a little easier. The first ones had a door angle piece right where you butt slides in that may be difficult with a large person. The plane Jim sent pics of shows the bottom door angle I am talking about. It apparently was not an issue for the owner so it may not be for you. It also appears to have the two stroke 582 engine which is what I fly . Once in you will probably feel strapped to the plane but it should be usable and enjoyable. I would suggest finding one and looking at it to see what I am talking about as far as size goes.
Mark Whiddon

[bbutler455]

A friend of mine was to big for the Avid Flyer A model he was building, so he ended up making it a single seater. His feet go on the outside pedals, and he made a joystick that had an S bend in it so it ended up more in the center of the plane. Worked just fine for him. The plane will probably be up for sale this spring, as he has some major health issues and probably wont make it till spring. Sad thing also, is he just put a new engine in the plane last fall, only has a couple of hours on it. I will be helping with the sale when the time comes. Another question that comes up when thinking about whether you will fit or not, is are you long legged or long torso? What is your inseam length? JImChuk

34" Inseam, 37" arms, and 54" jacket... wide shoulders and big belly. Jim, that is a very nice plane. I can see how that would work as a single. Can you get me specifics on the plane. Sorry to hear about your friend. Glad he got to finish and enjoy his plane. I will PM my contact information. Thanks. Brock

[bbutler455]

I fly an avid B model similar to the earlier kitfoxes. I do not think that even with bubble doors you would be able to make it a two person plane. Could you fit in it? Yes. I think any of the models either avid or kitfox would accommodate you but it is a small plane so be prepared for that. At six ft you might be cramped but I think you would be in anything that fits your desires. If you can get a kitfox 3-4 or a later avid it may make getting into a little easier. The first ones had a door angle piece right where you butt slides in that may be difficult with a large person. The plane Jim sent pics of shows the bottom door angle I am talking about. It apparently was not an issue for the owner so it may not be for you. It also appears to have the two stroke 582 engine which is what I fly . Once in you will probably feel strapped to the plane but it should be usable and enjoyable. I would suggest finding one and looking at it to see what I am talking about as far as size goes.
Mark Whiddon

Thank Mark, There is a Kit Fox wide cabin upgrade that adds 6" width. I wonder if that would make it possible to carry two people in a pinch. Would I have issues with max weight? I am 300 lbs of handsome manhood. Brock

[tx_swordguy]

I have the avid with bubble doors and with me 5'9 185 and my wife 5'4 and about the same we are ok. I think if you took someone well under 200 (more like 130) you can keep it under the max but engine size and turbulance would determine safe flight. I have about a 500 lb useful load which is pretty good however I don't think the 582 would be up to carrying that much on a hot summer day. IF you could fit 2 you may have to do it in cooler temp calm days. Fuel weighs 6lb per gallon so figure that up in your useful load. If you approach max loading your performance will suffer.

[bbutler455]

I have the avid with bubble doors and with me 5'9 185 and my wife 5'4 and about the same we are ok. I think if you took someone well under 200 (more like 130) you can keep it under the max but engine size and turbulance would determine safe flight. I have about a 500 lb useful load which is pretty good however I don't think the 582 would be up to carrying that much on a hot summer day. IF you could fit 2 you may have to do it in cooler temp calm days. Fuel weighs 6lb per gallon so figure that up in your useful load. If you approach max loading your performance will suffer.

So, If I understand correctly, other than being cramped with two people my constraint will be engine performance. Perhaps, for my first LSA I should plan on flying solo. If the bug catches me I can always buy more plane later.

Thanks for your reply Mark. Brock Butler

[tx_swordguy]

Yes, you will need to look at structural capability of any airplane (usefull load) vs engine performance. In otherwords if you have a plane cabable of hauling 1000 lb sitting behind a 40 horse engine it probably wont be able to do it in that configuration. But you put a 2000 hp engine in and it could probably do it pretty easy. Just because a plane is rated at a certain weight doesn't mean it is safe to fly it at said weight. Kitfoxes can handle anything from a rotax 582 up to a rotax 912 + engine so you can have a 40-50 hp difference in engines obviously a higher hp to weight engine is better if you will be flying at gross weight alot.

[av8rps]

I'm 6 ft and 185 lbs and flew an Avid A-Model for years, and took friends my size many times. Yeah, it was tight, but it worked. Oh, and my first one I flew on 160 lb floats and only 43 hp, and it had no trouble hauling the weight. So that early Avid with a 582 would most definitely be a good single seater for you to start out with. And if you love it, later upgrade to a newer Kitfox or maybe a Highlander. Either will work as 2 seaters even with a guy your size (I saw a 450 lb guy go for a ride in a Highlander with the owner, and somewhere on this forum is a talk about a really big guy in a Kitfox S). The newer planes are pretty roomy for being overall small aircraft, and they all pretty much haul what they weigh empty, sometimes more. Not many planes can claim that.

And if you don't want to hit the portfolio so hard, a less expensive option would be to just widen out and cabin lengthen an older airplane You can lengthen the leg room by either moving firewall and motor mount forward, or do like my one friend did with his A model Avid and move the seatback into the baggage area. It all just takes a torch and some tubing. Yeah, I know it sounds like a lot of work, but it would be much less money and effort than building a new plane. Even if you have to hire it out.

[Ramos]

I am 5' 9" and weigh 135 pounds. Just so happens that I respond to the words 'co-pilot' or 'passenger'.

If you remain focused on aircraft with bench-type side by side seating, you don't have to draw the line exactly down the middle.